i dont think spains a good place to settle

alex-armstrong,
which country would you suggest the best place to go to?

I agree.

Andalucia is a place not to be confused with Spain though.

Each region within Spain has its own unique quality and quirkiness.

As in any country really, but many regions within Spain whilst good or bad, tend to be far different from what most Expats experience and write on Spanish forums.

I had an discussion on another site about the violence in Benalmadena, that person was constantly stating its not violent and has never witnessed any.

Even after I posted quotes from the internet from news reports in Spanish (which he couldn`t understand as didn`t speak Spanish), a link to the Costa Del Sol Street Crime programmes etc etc.

His defence is its media hype, so no all the stabbings etc on a Saturday night is due to the media stabbing people, so as to get headlines.

Some expats cannot admit that they made a huge mistake and are to proud to either return to there homeland or integrate with Spanish people.

Had a laugh though, this numpty was critical of all the English walking around in there guiri cloths, I pointed out on his photos on the site he`d posted showing his grand kids using St George towels and wearing English football shirts.

He didn`t appreciate that.

Many Expats moved to Spain under the pretense that Spanish culture was far different than UK culture, in many ways it can be, but in many ways English culture doesn`t mix into Spanish culture unless your mentally able to set aside your National pride and accept the culture you`ve entered is many years behind the culture you left.

And Knife and gun crime is far worse in Spain than the UK has ever been.

Spanish govt does not do accurate surveys of anything bad, the UK is always publishing facts and figures on crime, finance etc etc.

The Spanish govt nope, until recently the Spanish govt was calling the Recession it was in, "a deceleration of the acceleration".

The Spanish economy always has been behind the rest of Europe, it is well aware that surveys telling people how bad any situation is would be bad for the country.


Many expats spend a few holidays there, assume its a nice place to live, then they move, which has resulted in many moving back.

We returned before the crisis, I got chatting with the guys moving us, about living in Spain, they told me then, that they move just as many back to the UK as they move to Spain.

the best place to live is the England, at least everyone gets some sort of chance in lfe, in Spain being foreigner is a big handicap, cant wait to get back to the UK and eat some decent food,

i live, work, shit, eat, and party with the Spanish so i am well integrated.

SO, i know the Spanish are hustlers


Alex

> the best place to live is the England, at least everyone gets some sort of chance in lfe, in Spain being foreigner is a big handicap, cant wait to get back to the UK and eat some decent food,

i live, work, shit, eat, and party with the Spanish so i am well integrated.

SO, i know the Spanish are hustlers


Alex



Great - Let us know when you're gone, we'll hold a party - after the fact.
So the fact that you're going gives you the prime opportunity to say how much you hate the place..

Qs: How many Brits have gone back to England hating Spain, vS English hating England and heading for Spain ?
Most Brits that are/have left is due to the exchange weakening I'm sure..

P.S: How come you've been "shitting with the Spanish" ??

Chocolate sports maybe ?
OMG !


DSB.

This is one survey though that the Spanish govt arn`t happy about.

http://www.ecologistasenaccion.org/spip.php?article15121

Spain now has been granted 300 Black Flags for there beaches.

In Andalucia many tourist are unaware that the sand, which has large graines in it, is actually builders rubble from sites around Spain.

The Junta prefers to use that rather than dredging sand from the sea, which is expensive. Also in Summer the sewage works around Malaga cannot cope and untreated waste is pumped in the sea near Torre Del Mar.

That results in the usual greeny brown slim washing up on the beaches around August time, they had planned more cleaning boats, but due to costs the required 35 boats to cover the area have been reduced to 3 now.

Last year the beaches around Malaga had the rubble from the new underground dumped onto the erroded beaches, fine but it wasn`t cleaned or treated.

>


Great - Let us know when you're gone, we'll hold a party - after the fact.
So the fact that you're going gives you the prime opportunity to say how much you hate the place..

Qs: How many Brits have gone back to England hating Spain, vS English hating England and heading for Spain ?
Most Brits that are/have left is due to the exchange weakening I'm sure..

P.S: How come you've been "shitting with the Spanish" ??

Chocolate sports maybe ?
OMG !


DSB.


Everybody is intitled to an opinion even bad ones.

Lets not take this to personnel insults.

> [quote author="bealerDSB" date="1248883734"]


Great - Let us know when you're gone, we'll hold a party - after the fact.
So the fact that you're going gives you the prime opportunity to say how much you hate the place..

Qs: How many Brits have gone back to England hating Spain, vS English hating England and heading for Spain ?
Most Brits that are/have left is due to the exchange weakening I'm sure..

P.S: How come you've been "shitting with the Spanish" ??

Chocolate sports maybe ?
OMG !


DSB.


Everybody is intitled to an opinion even bad ones.

Lets not take this to personnel insults.[/quote]

Understood.
I take the chocolate joke back / I saw the funny side to a statement is all.

But my opinion that there are more Brits in Spain than leaving still stands.

DSB.

have a read of this

http://www.surinenglish.com/20090724/news/costasol-malaga/chlorine-leak-affects-people-200907241821.html

ONLY IN SPAIN


PS. DSB how well do they treat the english kids in school in spain


Alex

> have a read of this

http://www.surinenglish.com/20090724/news/costasol-malaga/chlorine-leak-affects-people-200907241821.html

ONLY IN SPAIN


PS. DSB how well do they treat the english kids in school in spain


Alex


Alex,
Agreed, and the article sucks big time..

Going out on a limb here - But how many cases of "Fred West" and all that murder stuff go on in Spain ?
I'm not sure so I thought I'd throw it out there..

DSB.

believe me loads,

they just don't bother catching them unless the people involved are well off, its usually the police anyway



Alex

> cant wait to get back to the UK and eat some decent food


Eh? When did the Brits learn to cook?

>



Going out on a limb here - But how many cases of "Fred West" and all that murder stuff go on in Spain ?
I'm not sure so I thought I'd throw it out there..

DSB.


Franco managed too kill around 300,000, not personnally though, that was left to the fachas.

Jose Antonio Rodriguez Vega killed 16 women in the Santander in 1986.

Jorge Real Sierra and Jose Antonio Velazquez killed a British couple.

Then there is Mari Luz.

>

Eh? When did the Brits learn to cook?


When they left the cave.

Its a stupid arguement, all produce is available all over the world, some people can cook some can`t.

But just one thing.

Callos.

My grand parents where the last ones to eat Tripe, you of course can still buy it in the UK, "but why would you" ?

> [quote author="MartCross" date="1248898231"]

Eh? When did the Brits learn to cook?


When they left the cave.

Its a stupid arguement [/quote]

No it isn't. The general food culture in Spain is amongst the best in the world and even poor, badly educated people appreciate fish, ham, cheese, seasonal veg etc. The British are culinarily illiterate oafs who open packets. You can eat some of the best food in the world in London restaurants, but it will cost you ?50 a head, plus wine. Normal British food is mostly appalling. And what's wrong with callos? Not my favourite, but it's real food rather than junk.

in london, about 3 years ago i paid like 45 pounds for kebap for 4 people and they wouldn't even accept a card, how much is the minimum wage in the uk?. in dublin i got harrassed on a bus by a group of teenagers, i'm not white. but anyway, many times one's success or lack of it is thought to depend on the host country and not on the expat, mmm.
since there are 27 members in the eu, any eu citizen can try migrating to see which one is the best for them.
and of course there are the two empires, the usa and rusia.
canada, australia and south africa should be interesting for english speakers.
in any case if your country is not the third world, why move out?

>

No it isn't.


Its too complicated to gain an accurate account.


>
The general food culture in Spain is amongst the best in the world and even poor, badly educated people appreciate fish, ham, cheese, seasonal veg etc.


An appreciation of food does not make good cooks and it depends who and where you choose. There are poor regions in Spain that cook very poor food.

Same as a council estate in the UK.

All the Spanish supermarkets sell tinned meals such as Fabada, you can get pre packed Tortilla de Patata everywhere and just as many ready meals as the UK.


>
The British are culinarily illiterate oafs who open packets.


My sister in law cannot cook, she buys pre packed in Spain. My mother in law can burn milk.

I cooked a far better Paella than they can. They loved my Spag bol. I can also cook Chinese, Tai, Japanese and Italian food.


> And what's wrong with callos? Not my favourite, but it's real food rather than junk.


Nothing, my point not being that Callos is bad, just that food in Spain doesn`t change with time.

British Food in culinary circles is high on the list, it gets mocked by people who stereotype one experience.

Spanish food is in my opinion is lower in variety, not that its bad food, but it can be more poor mans food rather than technically challenging or flavoursome.

In a lot of resturants it will be a variety of old recipes or variations of the old ways.

They don`t generally mix flavours from other cultures or experiment. I`m talking in general everyday resturants.

A Menu for example would be cooked in the same way your grandmother would cook, its usually cooked by the owners wife or gran and would be the same as anybody would eat at home.

But thats what workers require, a home cooked meal, no venta would ever impress a chef from any country.

Italian and French chefs generally don`t rate Spanish food highly, beyond the fact its generally fresh and local.

Thats why its a stupid argument.

Its impossible to rate a country over another.

I like recipes from both countries.

My favorite Spanish ones I copy from this site

http://www.gastronomiavasca.net/recipes/index

My favorite English ones from this site although not a British site.

http://www.robertsplace.ca/recipes/britishindex.htm

>
in any case if your country is not the third world, why move out?


One TV programme commented that Spain as become the biggest British Council Estate outside of the UK.

In many Expat regions that very accurate, there are a lot of unskilled workers, plumbers, electricians, builders etc who didn`t make a great living in the UK.

Then they went on holiday and spotted the increase in Expats moving to Spain, add the TV programmes. This resulted in many believing that Spain would be better than there current situation on a council estate in the UK.

It depends who I speak to in the UK as to who I tell I moved to Spain.

As i`ve noticed different responses, one client guy of mine, top end of society type, flash car, big house was a bit rude in his response and opinion of Spain.

Others from a more modest lifestyle state they`d love to move to Spain and why did I ever move back.

I guess it depends on what lifestyle abroad you`ve experienced and finance available to you.

If money and work wasn`t an issue I could name hundreds of better places to live than Spain. But for certain class of people Spain offers a chance at paradise in the sun for few pounds, or so they believe.

I live by the rule if you dont like a place leave it. I don't know why you complain so much Santi when you are still living here. I understand that you work here and this is a recession but it sounds like you have been here for a while. I just don't understand why you would stay.

As for the origional post there are a lot of problems with Spain I agree and if you don't like you should leave like you are doing. I wish you all the best in England but I would say that after only being here for a month you have not had time to gauge it correctly, I am not saying stay but please state your opinion as it is not fact that Spain is one of the worst places in the world to live.

If anyone would like a real measure the UN released a study of the best places to live.

> I live by the rule if you dont like a place leave it.


I tend to examine before I give an opinion, saves making the wrong judgement.


>
I don't know why you complain so much Santi when you are still living here. I understand that you work here and this is a recession but it sounds like you have been here for a while. I just don't understand why you would stay.


See above statement.

I left Spain a year ago.

I return to Spain to visit my OH family and my friends.

I like Spain.

Its Andalucia I hate.

> I don't know why you complain so much Santi


DT,
I wouldn't stress it out too much.
I too have had Santi jump in on previous posts I assisted with, he was simply ignorant and very rude.
He stripped down my advice given and yet didn't not offer any advice to the post itself.
(This went on for many entries)

Like he said, he doesn't live in Spain anymore, so there you go.

I used to live in the States for many years, but I don't give forum advice on it as rules/times/public opinion change so much.
I still visit from time to time.

Suggestion in there somewhere me thinks..
Cheers DT.

DSB.

i have one word for spain

SAVAGES

stay there long enough you will become one

alex

> i have one word for spain

SAVAGES

stay there long enough you will become one

alex


DT,
Another person heading back to England FYI.
--
sav?ag?es
1. To assault ferociously.
2. To attack without restraint or pity

//YAWN//

DSB.

>
I too have had Santi jump in on previous posts I assisted with, he was simply ignorant and very rude.


I wasn`t rude, I simply pointed out my opinion.


>
He stripped down my advice given and yet didn't not offer any advice to the post itself.
(This went on for many entries)


Really.

Can you post the link as I cannot recall what you are refering too.


>
Like he said, he doesn't live in Spain anymore, so there you go.


My Spanish In laws arrived yesterday for the month.



>
I used to live in the States for many years, but I don't give forum advice on it as rules/times/public opinion change so much.



Yet you give advice on a place you haven`t lived in.

Opppppps.

How are you finding Spain today.;)


>

I bought my house over a year and a half ago and my Spanish bank gave me a 3,000 Euro Credit Card immediately..
I'm still not a resident as I am still overseas also......

DSB.


I`m happy to be told I`m wrong about Spain by people who live/lived there. ;)

Maybe DSB people wouldn`t be rude to you if you followed your own rules. :)

The post was about a person looking for decent bars in a certain area, I offered my advice whilst all you were interested in was chipping away at my views. This went on for several posts, and to this day you have yet to aid the person.
About the only think you've acheived, like this post, is clocking up your post counter.

I do live in Spain thanks, and you are nothing more than an argumentative provoking person.

Save your public issues for someone who gives a sh*t, like maybe the other people who have returned back to good ole UK.
Practice what your profile picture shows - cover it up.

DSB.

> The post was about a person looking for decent bars in a certain area, I offered my advice whilst all you were interested in was chipping away at my views. This went on for several posts, and to this day you have yet to aid the person.



Post the link, not hot air.


>
I do live in Spain thanks, and you are nothing more than an argumentative provoking person.


You moved quick and you didn`t inform us until today.


>
Robi,
Here is my dilemma.
I am working overseas, and my UK driving photo id license is now not valid as:

A: I lost it.
B: I no longer have a UK address.

I have a villa in Spain though, which I rent but as yet I?m not a resident - as I?m not there..

Can I,
Get a Spanish Driving License on my next visit with:
Passport, NIE & Spanish utility bill - my villa ??

Thanks;
DSB.



>
Save your public issues for someone who gives a sh*t, like maybe the other people who have returned back to good ole UK.
Practice what your profile picture shows - cover it up.

DSB.


Very useful advice, I see you following your own advice then.;)

Hi AA, I am interested to know why you left the UK in the first place, and what tempted you to Spain.

I have been here 10yrs now and although there have been lots of ups and downs. (Some being ripped off by fellow countrymen/women, others run in's with the 'red tape' here)... we still cannot think of returning to the UK.

Guess it is for some and not for others. (But at least you tried ;)

I live on the Costa Blanca and like all the costas along the mediterranean, none are really typical of Spain itself.
Having travelled extensively in Spain I can say that it is a beautiful country. With vibrant cities and much of it's historical monuments intact. There are wonderful national parks and natural features to, at least, rival any other European country and when you come away from the med you can get excellent accomodation very cheaply and excellent and varied food from region to region, of the highest quality, at very reasonable prices. The atlantic costas are totally different to those on the med and are extremely beautiful and much more reasonably priced in everthing. I have been staggered at some of the fantastic rooms we have had for under 30 euros for a double.
Too many people form their view of Spain from visiting one small part. Look around and spread your wings a bit.
Enjoy this beautiful land.
The meds OK for monging out and enjoying the sunshine but typical Spain? It aint!!!

Nice posts so far, a good mix of igonrance (original poster who i presume hae f**ked off back home) and other assorted attacks, its only a form people so relax we all have our own opinions of Spain and where we are originally from (i?m presuming all members are expats, hence the site name).

To put my oar in, i don?t think Spanish are all out to con you but they are a tad lazy in some ways and change does not happen fast. As for culture being behind other countries, i presume people are relating this to the UK (where i have lived but am not from). In the UK, what culture are you referring to, the culture of watching crap TV every night, or drinking as much as you can in 3-4 hours on a saturday night, maybe its the fantastic British food (so good that Chicken Tikka Masala is now the most popular sunday family dinner).

I noticed some people have mentioned crime but you cannot speak about crime figures if they are not released. To say violent crime happens more often here than the Uk but you can?t prove this because the Spanish government doesn?t release these figures is not clever. I could invent any point i like and then back it up with the same argument, so your argument doesn?t hold up Santi, simple as that.

To give an illustration of the differences in crime levels, picture this: How many elderly people do you see walking the streets in a small UK town after dark (especially on weekends) compared to small towns in Andalucia?

>

I noticed some people have mentioned crime but you cannot speak about crime figures if they are not released. To say violent crime happens more often here than the Uk but you can?t prove this because the Spanish government doesn?t release these figures is not clever. I could invent any point i like and then back it up with the same argument, so your argument doesn?t hold up Santi, simple as that.

To give an illustration of the differences in crime levels, picture this: How many elderly people do you see walking the streets in a small UK town after dark (especially on weekends) compared to small towns in Andalucia?


Not really.

If the UK constantly issues crime states and the Spanish doesn`t only one conclussion can be drawn, that there high.

Spain promotes itself as a top tourist destination, OK not hugely important to the economy, but enough to not want the same label as say the UK.

So anybody or govt wanting to promote is unlikely to offer independant stats if there high.

I witnessed a young guy(Early twenties) hit an man (around mid fifties) with a large plank of wood on a Sunday Morning in Fuengirola.

Both Spanish.

Turned out they had an issue over damage to a scooter and a revenge attack.

I`ve never needed to carry a knife and park the vehicle hidden and walk into a housing estate in the UK for fear of attack, in both Malaga and Marbella I and my Spanish collegue had too.

The family were friendly, offered us beer and tapita, normal looking Guitano`s, gold everywhere.

We did the work without hassle, but we never asked for documents or proof, that would have caused an issue.

Plus my collegue bought some Coke from them, not the type from a can either.

I`m sure somewhere it happens in the UK, although in 18yrs doin the job in a Capitol city never experienced it, within 18 months in Spain I did.

How often Grannies get assaulted in Spain, I don`t know officially.

Although last month an elderly gentleman shoot his elderly wife and last year the same happened only the husband stabbed her.

My point being Spain and the UK are similar when it comes to crime, not the same, but similar.

Guiris are usually in the Spain is far better than the UK camp, just to justify there reasons for leaving and the pride in knowing there right.

Even when they don`t/can`t watch/read Spanish news.

There seems to be a slagging off and labelling of a stereotypical image of the UK being non cultural, thats usually spread by people similar to guiri`s in Spain, in so much as they tend to be the ones laughing at the tradition`s of say either Morris or Mutxikoak dancing,whilst living in there little ghetto`s.

By which there travelled in so much as they leave there house, get on a plane to a Costa, get on the coach to hotel, spend all day on the beach and all night in John & Jackies bar, leave hotel, catch flight home.

There no more cultural in the UK.

Speak to anybody in the UK who has travelled around the UK and you`ll realise there is far more.

Culture doesn`t come to you in Spain or the UK, you have to want to find it.

English are the last to complain about how bad the UK is becoming, when the ones who left arn`t exactly promoting English culture in Southern Spain.

The Costa Del Sol and Costa Brava/Blanca`s are becoming known as council estates.

Its not the countries fault, its the people.

And by moving to Spain your not leaving the issues or suddenly becoming Spanish.

Original poster is either a troll or someone who needs to get a life.
Good to see not everyone is ignorant and prejudiced though

I can understand that people get all riled up with these type of discussions as some of the above comments got my blood boiling but at the end of the day it's incredibly simple, if you cant stand the heat... get out!

No more to be said.

>
and people tend to bum about here alot that's what they mean by the relaxed way of life. there is a spanish saying ive heard recently for every 1 person that works, 3 people watch

and also every ones out to con each other here, its a respected way of making a living.

its a shame its a beautiful place but at the same time its a shit hole.

dont fall for the spanish con

Alex


Amazing how someone is able to generalise over an area of half a million square kilometres!
There are currently between 40 and 50 million people in Spain who seem to disgree with you though about living here.
Several things worth pointing out.
1 of the top 10 billionaires in the world is spanish and came from very humble roots.
Several of the largest corporations in the world are spanish.
Spain is one of the top economies in the world.

As a foreigner in Spain, I can say catergorically "thank god my children were born here and are being raised here as opposed to several other countries I can think of.

But as always, each to their own