Hi All,
After 10 years of living La Vida Espanola, I am facing a moral decision of whether to stay or to go.
I am sure there are many out there in a similar situation.
Basically the financial climate has made it difficult to find work, plus I sustained injuries in an RTA
12 months ago and the court case is no where nearing a conclusion. (And may even be thrown out
due to a ‘technical’ error??!!!).
The money has run out, and although we are just hangin in there - I am beginning to find it hard to
cope with having to worry about paying the rent each month. (Let alone any ‘unexpected bills’ - car,
health matters etc that might crop up).
If any of you want to respond to this discussion - with personal views/experiences or just to hightlight
the pros and cons of Spain V’s UK - then please do write!
I need to work this out. I do have a little breathing space, but it is still short and it is such a big
decision.
Re returning to UK - I have already found out that to be eligible for any kind of benefits where I
an getting Income Support/Other - that I need to have been resident in UK for 26 WEEKS (yes, 6
months min) before an application is valid as the last time I did paid work here - and had NI credits was
2.5 years ago - and these tax years do not come into the current time period that would have given me
enough credits).
I ‘could’ throw myself on the mercy of friends and family in the UK - but that is not how I operate, nor do
I think I would be very happy/settled.
I didn’t think I would ever find myself in this position - but sadly you never know ‘what is around the corner’
(as we didn’t on that day the boy racer came at us head on and nearly killed us).
Without knowing where you’re considering going and what you could or couldn’t do for work, it’s hard to suggest anything. There are still jobs to be had in both countries if you have the skills which are in demand and you’re prepared to go where the work is. If you can do something in the public sector you’re fortunate. If you have to live on very little for a while whichever country you are in, then remember how damned expensive everything is in the UK. Despite inflation in Spain and the falling value of the pound, we still get much more for our cash when we’re in Granada than we do in Glasgow.
Hi MC,
I know my post was only brief, but the main problem I have regarding possiblity to work at present, is that I am too unwell to consider any kind of job. (As I would only be letting my employer down). So where I live in relation to work does not count.
Re the money going further here than in UK. Once it runs out - there is no support system here whatsoever. (As I have used up my ‘credits’ from when I did have a contract job). The system in the UK does not seem too friendly either in my current situation (see part of post regarding establishing residency/lack of rencent contributions to either system).
‘If’ there were any chance of a part-time job here at least that I COULD manage, then I would be able to add to the small amount my partner earns.
That would be the ideal, but it still leaves one open to dire situations should a further health matter etc crop up.
(As I don’t see any contract jobs on the horizons, so it would have to still be either ‘pay as you go’ or buy an expensive monthly private health plan).
I don’t want to become a sob story here - but any real practical/inspirational chat is welcome!
😊 sj
A few things you need to think about. Do you have a property back in england,if not what will u do for a home,renting in the Uk is more then here.
Does you partner work here and can he get a job in England.
Thing are getting a lot worse in the UK then here
Hi MC,
I know my post was only brief, but the main problem I have regarding possiblity to work at present, is that I am too unwell to consider any kind of job. (As I would only be letting my employer down). So where I live in relation to work does not count.
Re the money going further here than in UK. Once it runs out - there is no support system here whatsoever. (As I have used up my ‘credits’ from when I did have a contract job). The system in the UK does not seem too friendly either in my current situation (see part of post regarding establishing residency/lack of rencent contributions to either system).
‘If’ there were any chance of a part-time job here at least that I COULD manage, then I would be able to add to the small amount my partner earns.
That would be the ideal, but it still leaves one open to dire situations should a further health matter etc crop up.
(As I don’t see any contract jobs on the horizons, so it would have to still be either ‘pay as you go’ or buy an expensive monthly private health plan).
I don’t want to become a sob story here - but any real practical/inspirational chat is welcome!
😊 sj
I don’t know where you currently live but ... if you worked in Spain can’t you acced to paro (unemployment): it should pay up to 80% of your wage when working. Besides almost all Comunidades have funds to help people in your situation. Being a permanent resident, especially if you come from an EU Country, you have the right to apply for help exactly like Spaniards. Have you tried it already??
As for me, I live in Alicante and am thinking of moving as well. It’s true that the whole world is currently in a mess ... but from what I see the Spanish Government has NO intention of finding any concrete means, even unpopular, to try and solve the problem. I’m worried by the current system, offering money they don’t have ... and am already seeing huge tax increases. Besides either the finacial spanish newspaper Expansion, and the british The Economist, among others, foresee a huge crisis in Spain up to 2010 ... or longer. In my case, I’ve no intention of going back to Italy: the situation there is not any better that here, and taxes have reached an unbearable level. For that reason I’m thinking of leaving Europe to go to the other side of the world: Argentina is my current choice. But I still have an awful lot of things to check out…
bonjourno Fate,
Thank you for your comments. These are the kinds of internal dilemmas I am facing.
Regarding the Paro here - As far as I know I have no credits left - I did receive the full amount of paro (as you say up to 80% of ones last wage packet), but that was only for a limited period of 3.5 months as I had only had a ‘fijo’ contract for 18 months prior. (Before this I was autonomo and even though I paid the full Eu 230 pcm for Social Security - at that time it did not include Social Security contributions for anything other than medical care). I have not had any entitlement to any support since Dec 2006. (Hence the savings finally running out).
Are you/anyone aware of what I ‘might’ be entitled to other than this? I do not even qualify for medical cover any more as my ‘credits’ ran out, I am not a Spanish national, the UK do not offer any kind of reciprocal agreement for ex-pats. So things are looking pretty grim.
Please anyone that has any knowledge if I have ‘got it wrong’ (I have been to INME & Social Security - both of whom told me I had used up any credits for above) - and there IS some kind of financial help that I am entitled to! (Are there any gestors that are specialists in this? I know there are ones that specialize in matters of ‘laboral’ - but I am not working as I say and seem to be in some kind of black hole!),.
Fate. I hope you work out where is best for you too. I have always fancied Argentina as a holiday, but not thought about moving that far abroad.
But I guess anything is possible in this economic downturn/turmoil.
HOW DID THE BANKS/GOVT allow the situation to get in such a mess?!
bonjourno Fate,
Thank you for your comments. These are the kinds of internal dilemmas I am facing.
Regarding the Paro here - As far as I know I have no credits left - I did receive the full amount of paro (as you say up to 80% of ones last wage packet), but that was only for a limited period of 3.5 months as I had only had a ‘fijo’ contract for 18 months prior. (Before this I was autonomo and even though I paid the full Eu 230 pcm for Social Security - at that time it did not include Social Security contributions for anything other than medical care). I have not had any entitlement to any support since Dec 2006. (Hence the savings finally running out).
Are you/anyone aware of what I ‘might’ be entitled to other than this? I do not even qualify for medical cover any more as my ‘credits’ ran out, I am not a Spanish national, the UK do not offer any kind of reciprocal agreement for ex-pats. So things are looking pretty grim.
Please anyone that has any knowledge if I have ‘got it wrong’ (I have been to INME & Social Security - both of whom told me I had used up any credits for above) - and there IS some kind of financial help that I am entitled to! (Are there any gestors that are specialists in this? I know there are ones that specialize in matters of ‘laboral’ - but I am not working as I say and seem to be in some kind of black hole!),.
Fate. I hope you work out where is best for you too. I have always fancied Argentina as a holiday, but not thought about moving that far abroad.
But I guess anything is possible in this economic downturn/turmoil.
HOW DID THE BANKS/GOVT allow the situation to get in such a mess?!
Hanging in there…
sj
ps - Robi - You are right about your comment.
Susan ... my former husband was an autonomo too, so I know the situation rather well. What really sounds strange to me is what you say about medical care: coming from an EU Country you are entitled to emergency care, even if you never work. And if you have been, and still are, paying taxes in Spain, thus being permanent resident, you DO have right to FULL MEDICAL CARE ... as I currently do, although I’ve been working only for very short periods after I divorced in 2006 (and my ex-husband is Italian too, by the way ...). If you speak Spanish fluently, please read the following article:
So you either misunderstood ... or some idiot has been trying to cheat you. Although some Spaniards loathe the idea, Spain still belongs to the European Community ... :lol: What INEM and Social Security told was probably that you had used up the paro. To find out about medical care you’d go to the Consultorio Medico assigned to you (depending on the area where you live).
Susan, I don’t know if you are entitled to anything apart the paro. What I know is that lots of people, either spaniards or foreigner, in your situation, usually get in touch with the local social workers and ask for help. I know a couple of women who did so (one spanish and the other one from Ecuador) and now receive 300 euros each per month. I don’t know for how long, and am aware this wouldn’t solve your problems ... but something is better than nothing. I also don’t know if it’s the same all over Spain. Foe example, if you live in Andalucia I’m afraid it could be more difficult to get any help from local institutions.
Fate/Anyone interested in keeping up with this thread!
I did go to the social worker at the local medical centre (where I had been a registered patient for over 5years whilst working). She was spot on, very helpful and appeared to know the law very well. (Including advising me off the record that I should get a job, with a contract, then immediately go sick as I would then be ‘back in the system’). It appears that although a legal resident, up till recently a worker and tax payer, I do not even get basic medical cover if I am sick as I am no longer paying anything anywhere.
Robi has suggested I go back to SS offices, etc - All of which I will do, in person (and take an interpretuer friend if necessary. As although I am fairly fluent, one can miss the ‘nuances’)...
It has been very worrying having to pay for any medical attention I need as again, I seem to be in a black hole. It would be intersesting to find out that I am not the only one!
Thanks for all you replies,
SJ
(PS I did check with SS about paying voluntary contributions for medical cover - as one can in the UK - but at a whopping Eu220 pcm it was hardly economical).
The International DWP dept (Alicante Consulate) have advised the following:
Go back to INSS and put in a claim for Incapacity Benefit - although it is very likely to be refused as I have no SS credits.
Once it has been refused - go to local town hall where I am registered and ask for ‘Invalidez non - contribujativa’ - basically, social help with no contributions.
I may just give it one last shot. But having been round the houses already I don’t know how much energy I have got left for all of this.. :(
(Mainly as one has to have a 65% invalidity to qualify. I don’t know that I would reach that. The amount would be very small also).
The International DWP dept (Alicante Consulate) have advised the following:
Go back to INSS and put in a claim for Incapacity Benefit - although it is very likely to be refused as I have no SS credits.
Once it has been refused - go to local town hall where I am registered and ask for ‘Invalidez non - contribujativa’ - basically, social help with no contributions.
I may just give it one last shot. But having been round the houses already I don’t know how much energy I have got left for all of this.. :(
(Mainly as one has to have a 65% invalidity to qualify. I don’t know that I would reach that. The amount would be very small also).
Sorry Susan but really I CAN’T BELIEVE IT!!! 😖 How is it possible that things are so different, depending in which part of Spain you live?? I live in Alicante, have been working only a few times and for very short periods during the last 2 and a half years ... and NEVER EVER had any problem with medical assistance. I kept the same doctor, go whenever I need (recently I had a flu and he prescribed antibiotics, which I bought paying only a percentage of the real price) and so on. And NOBODY so far told me I was not entitled to it and I never received any letter advising me of it, never, ever.
Hi Fate,
I think it is a case of ‘Ask 50 people & you will get 50 different answers’.
I am glad you have never had any problems.
Possibly? if you have not had a period of’non work’ for more than 12 months in a row that is why you are still in the system.
Beyond this however, it would seem they know about it and you can be turned away without warning.
I will not go on with my trials here for the moment as it is making my head spin!
rgs to all
sj
Possibly? if you have not had a period of’non work’ for more than 12 months in a row that is why you are still in the system.
Beyond this however, it would seem they know about it and you can be turned away without warning.
I didn’t work for nearly 2 years ... and nothing happened.
And NO: they cannot turn you away being you an EU citizen ... it would go against EU laws and agreements between the various Countries. This is what really bothers me ... If you hold a British passport we both have the same rights, we’are both from EU Countries for God’s sake! 😖 In which region do you currently live??? :roll:
Hi Fate,
I admire your optimism. There is a website xxxx (I know we shouldn’t promote other websites here?) and they are specifially there to report the ‘abuse of the uk govt’ regarding the reciprocal agreements that we have with other EEA countries.
Thankfully I have very supportive family/friends and if it came to it… I would not be on the street
But I do not like to take and not put back… so am only using them in a dire emergency.
I do not think I have the energy to go to the INSS right now… So will try and think of ‘something else’ to remedy the situation.
I am just glad there are forums such as this to talk to someone.
Not that it is on my list.. But I am very impressed to see there is a Samaritans voluntary outfit on the Costa Blanca.
We all hope that being an Ex pat is going to run smoothly. But sometimes there is a need for help.
